2005/02/10

Got Nukes?

North Korea has for the first time announced publicly it has nuclear Weapons.

"We ... have manufactured nukes for self-defense to cope with the Bush administration's ever more undisguised policy to isolate and stifle the (North)," the North Korean Foreign Ministry said in a statement carried by the state-run Korean Central News Agency.

North Korea's "nuclear weapons will remain (a) nuclear deterrent for self-defense under any circumstances," the ministry said. "The present reality proves that only powerful strength can protect justice and truth."
"It said Washington's alleged attempt to topple the North's regime "compels us to take a measure to bolster its nuclear weapons arsenal in order to protect the ideology, system, freedom and democracy chosen by its people."

Bush, started his second term with a vow to end North Korea's nuclear program through six-nation talks. On Thursday, North Korea said it decided not to rejoin such talks any time soon after studying Bush's inaugural and State of the Union speeches and after Rice labeled North Korea one of the "outposts of tyranny." AP

On the other hand...

Washington (Bush) is trying to oust IAEA head Mohammed ElBaredei because he's too soft on Iran. They want someone who shares their views of which country represents a nuclear threat and what to do about it. AP

Can anyone explain how to pull an Iraq on a country with nuclear weapons?

13 Comments:

Oh sure you drop cluster bombs on Tehran citizens while marching in with 1/4-strength troops, flinging American flags everywhere and quoting the Bible! And Condi gives them the Stink Eye at the same time, that way they will cower before our greatness.
Nuclear Weapons? Don't matter cuz its over **there**, not **here.** The radiation will only kill brown people anyway. 

Posted by Sarah
2/10/2005 05:18:00 pm  
The problem is not the nuclear weapons but the government that controls them. Do you really really really think that dictator Kim Il Sung represents a sound mind to control such deadly devices? If you are true to your slogan "A group of people striving for justice & peace for humankind" then you shouldn't want to see Sung building even more nukes or you're just another hypocritical "peace" group whose sole purpose in life is to bash Bush. What will your lives be when Bush leaves in less than 4 years? Who will you target your hate to? "Peace for humankind" - you people are a joke, and I find the most hate-filled are those like you.

The most recent post you left at my site further demonstrates my observations are correct. It's on the record, not to be deleted, that you would love for me to die - I would never want that to happen to you. So tell me - who is the real lover of peace? 

Posted by Maddie Dog
2/10/2005 05:36:00 pm  
Maddie, get a grip. When Americans stop building, testing, and selling nuclear weapons, then we will have the right to run around the world like nannies shaking our finger at everyone who doesn't abide by our playground rules. You may enjoy having the rest of the world react negatively to our Administration's hypocrisy, but I think America is better than that. We deserve a foreign policy approach with more honor and integrity than the one we have been getting.
I don't know who wrote that they want you, Maddie Dog to die, but I would suggest not taking everything you see on the Internet personally. 

Posted by Sarah
2/10/2005 06:25:00 pm  
Put the comment here for all to read Maddie and we'll discuss it further.

You avoided my question as is usual with you folks.

Can anyone explain how to pull an Iraq on a country with nuclear weapons?

Do you really really really think that dictator Kim Il Sung represents a sound mind to control such deadly devices?.

No, in fact I don't but I understand it. Sovereign countries tend to want to protect themselves and their right to live as they please.

Do you really really really think that a former alcoholic, drug user and AWOL from the military George Bush represents a sound mind to control such deadly devices?

What will your lives be when Bush leaves in less than 4 years?.

If only he would leave now. I sign every impeachment petition I can find with hope. I am not being sarcastic. I am being truthful. The man is a disgrace to humankind. That you cannot think beyond America is a personal problem but don't expect those of us who can to have the same skewed vision.  

Posted by Dianne
2/10/2005 06:39:00 pm  
we are in quite a pickle huh? 

Posted by angiekruger
2/10/2005 06:46:00 pm  
“then you shouldn't want to see Sung building even more nukes”.

Who said we wish it? Why do you twist the message of the post? The post Dianne made didn't infer she condone North Korea developping its nuclear arsenal, it merely pointed out the result of the Bush policies, something that anyone with half a brain could have guessed, and which is:

Bush makes it loud and clear he wants to go around the world bash ppl on the head. He's already proven he means it by having invaded and demolished Iraq. In spite of the fact Iraq's military power was peanuts against the US military machine, it still wasn't so easy. So, the obvious reaction from other countries pointed by Bush is: "if we have enough a military deterrent, Bush will think twice before trying his Iraq trick on us".

What's so hard to understand there? Or do you think ppl who Bush threatened should go "yes sir, please come invade us, and look, we'll make it easier for you by not arming ourselves to the teeth"?

“The problem is not the nuclear weapons but the government that controls them.”.

That sounds nearly half reasonable. So, let's see "HOW" are we to decide which are the governments who should control them and which are those who should not have the weapons? Maybe, since deciding on moral grounds might obviously get nowhere (what one person think is right, another will think wrong), we should perhaps look at the facts, i.e. the records of various countries showing how responsible they have been so far handling owning nukes.

Dang... looks like ALL countries in the world should be allowed nukes EXCEPT the USA since they are the only country which so far has dropped atomic bombs on other ppl.

Are you happy settling for this?

“It's on the record, not to be deleted, that you would love for me to die - I would never want that to happen to you”.

Since you bring it up, I'll recap it here myself:

You posted a long rant of questions and answers on your site. One of them was about health care, and went thus "A. Should we have free medicine? Q. I sure hope not". To which I sarcastically replied "I hope so too, and next time you're in need for medicine you can't afford, you'll kark it, and the world will be just that little bit better off".

Isn't it the truth? You advocate denying medicine made available to everyone, i.e. you say out loud "I don't care if ppl who can't afford health care die en masse". I say "I cannot accept this type of view, this is fascist talk". Yes, in view of your inciting ppl risking death on a large scale, the world WOULD be a better place without you, and it would be a befitting if you died from your own sword. 

Posted by WhyNot
2/10/2005 07:41:00 pm  
A little extra info. I spent a year in Korea and I'm probably going to be heading back there this summer, so I've done some research on the Democratic People's Republic of Korea (North Korea).

Kim Il-Sung died a couple years ago, leaving the control of the Stalinist state to his son, Kim Jong-Il. There are several theories about his state of mind, one of which involves a head injury he suffered in the late nineties.

Kim Jong-Il's regime is one of the most brutal on the planet, speech against the state is punishable by life in a "labor camp" or death. Children learn primarily propaganda in school. For boys, the highest hope is to join the military, since that is the only profession that guarantees regular meals. For girls, beauty contests are held in high schools, and the winners are presented before "Our Dear Leader" for him to hand-pick members of "pleasure teams." These are concubines who staff his various pleasure palaces the dot the country.

North Korea has been working on SCUD missile technology since before Iraq got their hands on them, and in the mid-nineties was working on an updated model (the No-Dong) that was meant to be able to reach the US' west coast.

Several million North Koreans are being held in concentration camps, where the conditions are comparable to Auswitz/Bikenau in Nazi-occupied Poland. Women are gang-raped and everyone is literally worked to death, only being fed enough to delay the inevitable.

They have an army that, with mobilized reserves, numbers over a million.

North Korea scares the shit out of me. 

Posted by brogonzo
2/10/2005 07:56:00 pm  
My dad who fought in the Korean war told me many times, "they hate us." I have watched many documentaries here in France (one where a man was able to get into North Korea with a hidden camera. I agree this is a horrible regime. But, we have to find better ways to reach these people. War will not work, in this case especially. I only hope Mr. Bush doesn't decide the collataral damage from a nuclear bomb, since it is so far from America, will be worth it.
 

Posted by Dianne
2/10/2005 08:10:00 pm  
“North Korea scares the shit out of me.”.

I agree. I'd say most ppl would agree. In fact, from memory, when Bush was in his early days of starting his nomination award of countries belonging to his Axis of Evil, there was pretty much worldwide unanimous agreement that the North Korean regime is one hell of an off-the-planet case.

One more reason not to threaten them with being bashed on the head. We are not talking to "reasonable" ppl there, we're talking to nutcases. Nutcases with deadly WMDs. Nutcases who also suffer from grand paranoia. It's like, at the everyday level, talking to a madman who's locked himself in a school with 1200 kids and 3 tons of explosives, a bit like happened in Russia not that long ago.

How to deal with the human rights issues there, I don't know. How to deal with their belliquous attitude, I don't know either. But I'm sure as hell that the more the US throw their weight around and the more they give hints that Nth Korea is next on the hit list, the less they are likely to surrender, and the more they are likely to blow up this planet if it's what it takes to resist a Bush invasion. 

Posted by WhyNot
2/10/2005 08:22:00 pm  
LOL

Talk about twisting things around. I'll just let you all wallow in your hate.

The majority of Americans seem to disagree with your sad little club.

LOL 

Posted by Maddie Dog
2/10/2005 10:37:00 pm  
In other words Maddie you have no case. I didn't think so.  

Posted by Dianne
2/10/2005 10:52:00 pm  
A couple of points...

From the North Korean's (and the Iranians) point of view, it makes perfect sense to acquire nuclear weapons if possible. It even makes sense for them to export the technology for profit...France does both, and I have heard no one here protesting it.

From the American's point of view, it would make much more sense for them to rattle the sabres of war, or even go to war, against North Korea instead of Iran. Presently, even the most optimistic estimates put North Korea's ability to actually deliver a nuclear weapon allow them to at best deliver one or two, in a very unreliable fashion, to our extreme west coast or Hawaii (if their targeting systems could find something that size). Why wait until they can deliver dozens into the heartland of the U.S.?

From the rest of the world's point of view, they should be going all out to do two things:

a: Come up with a means to convince the North Koreans that the United States, at some point in time, will do something about their capabilities.

b: Convince Iran that it isn't the U.S. that is going to eventually take out their nuclear ambitions - it will be Israel, which has far less patience with enemies that wish to acquire means to attack them (see: Iraqi reactor attack) than the U.S.

Yes, the are conflicting views, but that is what the life is made of... 

Posted by Buckwheat
2/11/2005 01:20:00 am  
Sad little club? I do not feel sad.

Unfortunately, nuclear weapons technology was created and it is only a matter of time for countries who really want nuclear bombs, to develop them. The ghost of Hiroshima will haunt us forever. 

Posted by Dr. Marco
2/11/2005 02:42:00 am  

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